Furniture for kitchen

[Anchic]

Anchic, Anh, there is the simplest program Pro100, you can draw and rotate 3D, even if there are no large libraries of materials, in this sense it is primitive, but you can understand what to sculpt where.

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Why can't this column be placed by the window?

OK. Column by the window. With your customary attachment to the sink and sink along the long wall, as you have it now. Only I had to reduce the extension by a few centimeters in depth. On the table with the extension relative to the facades, it will be almost the same as what you have now. That is, 39 or 40 cm.

In total, the total length turns out to be about 301 cm. Stock for finishing and so-and-so. respectively, 7 cm.
You can try to put a refrigerator instead of a column.
As for the proximity of the column with the "main" headset, I advise you to scroll the topic back.
In the subject there were pictures of how the corner of the table with the extension relative to the facades protrudes badly relative to the column with the oven and microwave: https://mcooker-enm.tomathouse.com/in...366.0
On the same page, there are links to articles by furniture makers on the arrangement of a sink in a corner underframe.
And I don't want to count in a fashionable way without taking out the table.
This bulging corner is another reason to think about what is better to put in the corner by the window - a column with an oven, a refrigerator, a narrower pencil case, or just a table, and figs with it, that the window sill is lower.

Removal of the window sill relative to the wall in any arrangement, that with a column from the oven and microwave at the window, that with a refrigerator, will have to be removed completely or partially (see the pictures in the topic, on the previous pages there were photos with window sills of variable depth).

Where?

Discussing Blackout cuisine.

Normal

How is the baseball player in shape?

Well, please, your benefit performance

I am not discussing your forms, between times.

In the meantime, you have released enough incorrect statements that I have not commented on in any way.

in general, after your words, I'm not interested in communicating with you.

Your "practical" experience, which you so diligently present as "overvalued", was also of little interest to me. Everyone has their own experience, you know. As well as not interesting was the special olympiad in show-off organized by you with the only participant in your person, in which I immediately refused to participate and recognized you as the absolute champion. Good luck in finding someone else who will not immediately refuse to "measure the tiles" or something else.

[OlgaGera]

OlgaGera, Lel, write to me, and I think, to many others, your experience is interesting. Anyone in general practical the experience is interesting.

[Olya]

Olya, create a theme. It is unlikely here. The kitchen specialist will answer. Find pictures, draw. But to use, this is no longer for them. Everything will be more or less ergonomic. I really can't imagine that this is possible.

[renard]

As if Anya is now using another sink, her kitchen is not angular, and she has room to increase the underframe of the sink.
She also wrote that her husband had attached 40 cm deep tables to the side of the sink in the old linear kitchen.
It is clear that her sink is now about 80 cm, with a facade of 40, it would not have been possible to attach such tables to the side of another. And the sink bowl, most likely, is cut into the edge of the underframe, that is, it is located exactly in the center of the facade.

renard, you are a terrible person Yes, now I have a table with a sink 80, a work table 80 and a cabinet 40 standing from the pantry, then a remake of my husband with a built-in cooker / oven. Facades 40. Sink - stainless steel with a wing. The wing, respectively, is in the corner, and the sink is about 40cm away from the wall. That is, I wash the dishes while standing in front of the sink. Our attached table has two bevels: one to enter the kitchen without knocking the corners, and the second to open the second door at least 45 degrees, since it already exists.

Anchic, Anh, there is the simplest program Pro100, you can draw and rotate 3D, even if there are no large libraries of materials, in this sense it is primitive, but you can understand what to sculpt where.

Yes, I found a bunch of calculators, and here they gave links. I will draw, or rather, I even began to draw. I need to comb my hair in order. The main thing is that I have a car and a small cart - there is no need for repairs in the plans for the next year. So everything can be thought out better.

That is, I wash the dishes while standing in front of the sink. Our attached table has two bevels: one to enter the kitchen without knocking the corners, and the second to open the second door at least 45 degrees, since it already exists.

Well, how are your back and forehead? Do not suffer?

[renard]

renard, yes no No, there are no questions about this arrangement, since mine is already 6 years old, if it is with a curbstone attached.

[Anchic]

Anchic, well, my sink is also embedded, only the underframe is a standard corner 100 with a facade of 40.
I don't have a PMM in this kitchen, there is a table that can be replaced with a PMM. That is, I wash the dishes by hand, my back does not fall off. True, I am shorter than you. Height 170.
In some versions, I drew sinks 85 and 90 long with a 45th facade, in them there is a "hole" in the "meter corner" to the pipes wider, and the sink can be shifted a little more from the corner.
That's just due to the fact that the information about the size of the wall at the window for the installation of the kitchen was not immediately received, some of the drawings, for example, with a beveled 30 module near the window, are not in the subject.
I thought that everything was very bad with that wall. The width is about 33, the furniture will hit the window by at least 27 cm, the window will not open normally, there will be problems with the curtains.
But it turns out that there is no problem. Make the dawn angle of the slope smaller, stick the curvilinear window sill - and a normal wall will turn out to be suitable for installing a kitchen.
Unless the battery is too close to that corner. Not close according to your drawing ...
Okay, to defuse the situation, a video about mistakes in the kitchen.
A guy made a cheap kitchen in his house and filmed a video on how to save money. People came to comment. The kitchen was criticized, partly rightly, partly not, because such things as which facade is better - glossy or matte, which PMM is better - 45 or 60, where is the dish drying better - above or below, and is it needed at all, the refrigerator is far away from the working area - is it good or bad, is there a need for a bevel at the entrance to the kitchen, do the kitchen with handles or without, should there be only drawers in the deep lower tables, which shelves should be in the wall cabinets - high or not, etc. individual preferences.
The guy summarized the comments and shot a mocking vidos about his "disgusting kitchen".

I agree with some of the comments. For example, about the fact that the sink is embedded close to the corner, that the square sink is more capacious than the round one, and that the distance from the sink to the stove is too small, that the hood had to be either set higher, or the built-in non-retractable one. Well, and with some other comments, I see no reason to list everything.




Ah, yes ... The picture of the sink bowl in the figures is schematic. I am for a rectangular shape. In a drawing room, most of the sinks are just round, and I am too lazy to re-photozhablivat at the drawing room.

[renard]

renardThank you so much for all your tips and trivia that you point out.

Window sills of variable width.
More expensive, something like this might work:

There is no point in fooling around with the wood grouse at the bottom of the entire window and disfiguring the window, since the pier for installing the kitchen is normal. That version with a capercaillie was proposed under a narrow 33 cm wall.

As I understand it, the oven under the hob gives a good work surface. Trying to lift the oven creates tension on this surface.

It is for this reason that I have not had any columns and never will. I don't use the oven so often that it is very difficult to bend over. But I use the work surface all the time.

I don't use the oven that often

And I, if not every day, then every other day for sure. Therefore, I want to. I bake bread in the oven. Here I baked on Friday first black, then white. Today I'm baking white again. And maybe tomorrow I'm still baking - the breadcrumbs are over, we need to dry the bread.

I realized that I would need to move the battery a little if the refrigerator is moved to another corner. Now the refrigerator is 20 cm from the heating riser.And the battery does not interfere with opening the freezer at all. If you move it to a different corner and put it as close to the outer wall as possible, then you need to move the battery, otherwise the freezer door will not open completely and access to it will be difficult.

So I do every other day and think that not often. Bent over - put the form - bent over - pulled out the form. That's all.
And on the work surface, I like it to be spacious.
In addition, a large work surface allows assistants to participate. I remember that in a small kitchen I was always alone in pantyhose, because it is easier to do everything myself than to beat ass. And in the big kitchen, the husband will cut the meat and vegetables and make a salad - he has his own table, I have my own.

[Wiki]

I don’t understand why close the battery from above? And push the riser into the box? It happens in the winter that we completely disconnect the battery, because we have enough heat from the riser. If the riser is in the box, then this heat will not be. And it's hot with the battery. Well, if the battery is covered from above, then it also works worse right away! After all, natural convection is already very badly disturbed. That is, choose a battery that is designed so that air must pass through it and close it on top?



Wiki, so the fact is that now my micra is hanging on the shelf. There is a pedestal with a planetary under the shelf. If I do not make a column, then all the same, 60 cm will be consumed by my micra. Or again invent it on the shelf. But you can't hang it high, and if it's low, you can't really put anything under it. Now the cabinet is homemade, so we made the height so that the mixer could fit, it is below the table. And I will not make headsets of different heights.

It is for this reason that I have not had any columns and never will. I don't use the oven so often that it is very difficult to bend over. But I use the work surface all the time.

Well why
I have a column next to the hob. At the bottom of the column there are: a drawer for pans "on the edge", above the drawer for lids "on the edge", above the oven, above the microwave - and everything is in one column, everything is at hand, next to the hob A under the hob are the usual drawers for dining rooms devices and various necessary little things (4 boxes)
And it is very convenient to keep everything close at hand: pans, lids, cutlery with small things, and the hob, and you don't need to climb into the oven "pop up" (albeit rarely), and the micra does not take up space on the table ...
And just something, I changed the places of the oven with kitchen drawers

The principle of this arrangement (from left to right): a column with an oven-micro-pans-lids, a hob, a cutting table, a sink. Practically, you only need to stand at the table, and on the left and right there is a stove and a sink, and you don't need to go far, to stomp, all the main pleasures are within walking distance and accessibility

[Tatyana]

Tatyana, is there any space between the column and the cooking? I just understand that there needs to be at least 15 cm so that the frying pan with a handle fits.



In this planner, the window is a little crooked. But overall, quite handy:
View from above:

External wall:




The walls are very, very crooked. In real life, you should probably count on 2950mm.

Tatyana, is there any space between the column and the cooking?

Yes, from the column to the hob there is about 15 cm, I used this space at the bottom of a narrow drawer-shelf, where there are bottles of oil. It is also very convenient, close at hand.That is, under the hob I have placed two objects: a narrow shelf for oil and drawers 40-50 cm.

I realized that I would need to move the battery a little if the refrigerator is moved to another corner.

Judging by the picture that you posted, you will have to move the battery a little, and if in the very corner there is some kind of module with drawers or with a door wider than 40 cm.The battery will also prevent them from opening.
Options for getting out of the situation without transferring the battery - either push the module with very narrow hinged facades into a corner, or do not bring the furniture to the end of the wall by the thickness of the battery.

It is for this reason that I have not had any columns and never will.

The column is also a very individual matter.
For some, it may be an important requirement in the layout of the kitchen, for example, if the oven is used very often and / or there are small children in the family. Someone does not care whether the oven is under the cooking or in the column.
Both options have their pros and cons. It is more convenient to use the oven in the column. No column - more work surfaces.

I don’t understand why close the battery from above?

So that it does not pour into the battery and does not fall from the window sill and to increase the width of the window sill.
There are nuances with the width of the window sill, the general rule is that if the battery is located in height close to the window sill, then it cannot be closed with a deaf window sill without ventilation grilles by more than 2/3 of the thickness of the battery. You can often find a recommendation that the window sill should not cover the battery by more than 1/2 of its thickness.
Warm air from the radiator should rise to the window; a large extension of the window sill can disrupt the correct circulation of warm air near the window.

However, if there is a long distance between the window sill and the battery, or there are ventilation grilles in the window sill, then the entire battery can be closed. But what distance should be between the battery and the window sill in height, so that you can do this - I will not tell you at once. I don’t remember, we have to look for records after consulting with window workers.

And push the riser into the box?

This is also an individual matter. In repairs with a claim to "steepness", the heating risers are sewn up "for beauty", in order to increase the width of the slopes and put the window sill deeper, and so that the furniture can be placed close to the wall along the wall with the riser.
In my apartments, I am afraid to sew up the heating riser. In my family, twice the bay was passed through the heating risers when access to the riser was needed. Therefore, there is a categorical conviction that it is not good to sew up the heating riser.

And I, if not every day, then every other day for sure. Therefore, I want to. I bake bread in the oven.

Now my oven is at the table level, how convenient it is, especially with a sore back! Planting bread in the oven makes it much easier and safer to work with steam.
I got a stove quite recently, so I haven't seen enough of this "movie" yet and often admire the "screen" while baking. Yesterday in the night I watched how croissants from puff pastry grew and swelled.

Options for getting out of the situation without transferring the battery - either push the module with very narrow hinged facades into a corner, or do not bring the furniture to the end of the wall by the thickness of the battery.

And ... You can also make a video from a khrushcheba like an aunt's. Beveled module with a 40-hinged front corner. near the window. There, after all, a little bit is not enough to open 40s.




Ugh you ... Why don't you stand the battery, where is it actually drawn?
Because of this, I got confused in size.
Where the furniture is, you get 580 walls and 420 up to the thermal head on the battery?
Then maybe 40 will open normally. It depends on how much plaster will be thrown on the wall.
The case of cabinets with a facade is exactly 580. With the removal of the countertops relative to the facades - 600.
Well, and the facade is actually not exactly 400, but a few millimeters less.
That is, without leveling the wall with plaster 40, the facade in the corner will open exactly.
After finishing, it can stick into the thermal head of the battery.

Ugh you ... Why don't you stand the battery, where is it actually drawn?

The entrance to the kitchen is on the left side, if you face the kitchen. Opposite the entrance, there is a heating riser in the corner. And the kitchen module itself is on the right wall. The pantry is also on the right in front of the entrance to the kitchen.



If you look at the picture, then my apartment is on the left, further from the elevator, next to the steps.

And the length of the kitchen, in fact, means not even 3.08, as in the BTI documents, but 3.05?
Sorry, sorry. Well, that means that it is better not to plan furniture with a length of more than 3 meters if you will plaster the walls.
And about the door.In an amicable way, in a beautiful way, in a convenient way, on the door it is necessary to lay a width equal to at least the width of the canvas plus 30, and preferably 40 cm.
Under the 70th door, the width of the doorway is 80 (5 cm on each side for the frame and foam seams). Plus "flanges" to the left and right of the door at least 10 centimeters. It turns out 1 meter.
And if there is also a margin for finishing, plus, where the hinges are, make a larger flange so that the door opening angle is larger, then 1.1 meter runs up.
But ... In typical series of panel houses, it is often simply impossible to do it in an amicable and beautiful way, only at least 80 cm, necessary for installation, is obtained under the kitchen door.
Therefore, it is up to you to decide and prioritize. The door is correct, the door is slightly ugly, or no door at all.

We have there under the door "native" is now involved 90cm - door 70 plus 10cm on each side.

And the length of the kitchen, in fact, means not even 3.08, as in the BTI documents, but 3.05?

Unfortunately. More precisely, it is possible somewhere and it will be 3.08, but you move 10-20 cm and it will already be 3.05. I measured along the furniture in the front, there is 3.05. A little closer to the wall about 3.07. Perhaps there will be 3.08 along the wall. But yes, you cannot count more than 3 meters. And it's better to count 2.95. Because the walls are very different. Plastering is imperative, because now bare concrete and it is necessary to put at least a thin layer of plaster on it, otherwise the finish will not adhere well. We were doing cosmetic repairs in the rooms on our own. In the first room, they plastered it straight to a minimum, the holes were plastered over and that's it. So on the outer wall then the wallpaper was stuck to glue - it seemed to be processed by something, the wallpaper does not hold well to it. Then, in another room, they simply covered it with a thin layer of plaster and everything stuck with a bang. And it does not go away, unlike the first one.

[Anchic]

Anchic, here's a vidos about the formation of openings for interior doors:
🔗
I measured it on my kitchen door. A door with a linen 70 cm wide, on the side where the platbands and extensions, together with the platbands, occupies about 89-90 cm.On the side where there are no extras, the door with platbands and extensions takes about 86 cm.

[renard]

renard, they say that so often karma cannot be raised to the user Thank you!

No column - more work surfaces.

Which ones and why?
If you have in mind an additional table to put a micra on it, then this is not a convenience, since the floor space is occupied, and it is inconvenient to use it.

My layout for furniture was originally like this: mentally lay out all my kitchen utensils on the floor, look at their quantity, their purpose, and think about the convenience of their placement and where, how. For example, the same pans, lids, bottles of oil-sauces-vinegar (of which there are always many), ovens and other good things that need space and convenience.

Now you need to go to a store that deals with kitchen furniture and look at the catalogs of those bells and whistles that you can build in and use at home. For example, I built a column in this way, so that I could shove pans with lids, and not look for a place for them in other cabinets in the kitchen, thereby gaining a place.

Another example, I also have a large corner cabinet (I agree that it is not always convenient), but I built a metal carousel into it on two floors, where I placed different and some pots and all the plastic that I need constantly at hand. The advantage of the carousel is that it can be rotated in different directions, thus providing free access to the utensils without diving into the cabinet with your head "butt up" - it turned out to be convenient. And the upper surface (above the carousel) turned out to be convenient for installing the blender, the combine and working with them, while the working surface near the stove was free for processing food - that's how we got two surfaces for cooking at once.
Moreover, my "wall" was built in this way: a column (pans-lids-oven-micra (60 cm) + hob (50 cm) + work table (60 cm) + sink (water 50 cm) + corner table-surface (90 cm.) And further around the corner there was also a 90 cm cupboard.(at the bottom there is a bunch of pots of all kinds, at the top there is a sideboard for dishes-jugs-plates. Plus, a narrow cabinet with shelves for various cans-cereals, and a freezer of 60 cm fit into this. This is practically 1, 5 walls of the kitchen.

And all the same, there is not enough space, with the kitchen size ... 14 meters

What gadgets I bought specially from the catalog:
- Narrow drawers 15 cm wide - 3 pcs. for oil bottles, for vinegar-sauce bottles, for cutting boards. These cabinets were mounted in narrow openings to fill the space, and thus both the openings were filled and the space won out for small things. Otherwise, these bottles would have to be shoved into the cupboards.
- Carousel movable in a corner cabinet - a very handy piece when placing furniture in a corner, so as not to dive into a deep cabinet with your head
- A pull-out drawer with a lattice for placing pans of all stripes and saucepans - all in one place at once, and are placed "on the edge". Than freed up space on work surfaces and in cabinets
- A pull-out drawer with a grid for lids for pots and pans - all at once in one storage place, placed "on the edge" which makes it convenient to take and find the right one. Than freed up space in the closets.
The drawers are placed one over one in a column under the oven.

[Wiki]

If you have in mind an additional table to put a micra on it, then this is not a convenience, since the floor space is occupied, and it is inconvenient to use it.

There are never too many work surfaces in the kitchen. There is always what to put on them and what to do on them. For example, as I already wrote Wiki, a lot of work surfaces can be convenient if two people are cooking in the kitchen.
And if the kitchen has a large table, then it is not at all necessary to put a microwave on it. If users are tall, then it can be placed in a shelf above the table. If users are of medium height, then it can be placed on brackets under the shelves above the table. If the family has children of primary school age. who can heat their own lunch in the microwave, the micra can be convenient on the table so that the child can reach it.

renard, they say that so often the user cannot raise karma

Yes, they say that to me too. Vicki wanted to add it 2 times, but they don't allow it.

work table (60 cm) + sink (water 50 cm) + corner table-surface (90 cm)

And all the same, there is not enough space, with the size of the kitchen ... 14 meters

That is, the work surfaces in your kitchen are 1.5 linear meters, and you do not have any questions about why there are so many.
And to someone else's kitchen or kitchens, which are two less than yours in area, where, if the oven is installed in a column of working surfaces 60 cm deep, it turns out no more than 1.2-1.1 meters, and not as a solid surface, but in pieces, questions arise, why so many work surfaces ...
Well, why bother. Work on them, work, cook, put small kitchen appliances on it during cooking. A multicooker on the countertop forever. Pepelats in the form of an airfryer. Or here, like Anya's - a planetary blender .. Or a thermopot, maybe they constantly love to drive teas. Or a coffee maker or even a coffee machine, maybe users are coffee gourmets, drug addicts ... But you never know, there may still be items that are used constantly, and which are removed from tables every time.

If users are tall, then

If only, if only ...
That's what I am writing about, that the options for placing furniture and utensils on it should be viewed "before" and not after the furniture was installed to fill the space, and now we will shove our goods into the cabinets.
And then, children also grow quickly, soon it will turn out that micra is either low or high - more convenient is the best option for all family members

That is, the work surfaces in your kitchen are 1.5 linear meters, and you do not have any questions about why there are so many.

And if you calculate the footage correctly?

There is no need to look for flaws in others and try to emphasize them. I didn't write about that

[Anchic]

Let's compare two pictures that I rioted for Anya's kitchen.
This one without a column is 305 long, but maybe 300 if the corner sink is cut off by another 5 cm, and maybe the modules, if it takes more than 5 cm to finish.
the inscription "somewhere here microwave" just hints that the location of the microwave is not necessary on the table.
Somewhere in the corner. And where - on a table, in a shelf, under a shelf on crumbs - it's more convenient for users.
For myself, I probably would have slapped a small microwave in the corner under the shelves, but not on the table. it turns out not high, not low and space on the tabletop and in the shelves is not occupied.

Work surfaces 80 cm wide - 1.6 meters. There are still small ones, but they can be disregarded, because the kitchen is not a standard corner kitchen, the modules are shallow along the short wall, the surface on the side of the sink bowl will most likely be made with some items for washing dishes. The surface on the side of the sink is 40-50 centimeters in general dead, you can't put anything there, because if you put it, objects put on the counter will be touched during operation at the sink. The surface from the very edge is also not working; most likely, they will put some kind of small equipment on it.

This one with a column, 300 in length and a corner sink, shredded to 80 cm.

There is a minimum of working surfaces 60 cm deep, and it may also be necessary to reduce the modules even further, since 5 cm for finishing is a very small margin.
One 60x40, one 60x60. Passable, but not really going to get loose.

And if you calculate the footage correctly?

What is the right way then? Work table 60 cm plus a corner table with a surface of 90. Only 1.5 meters.

That's what I'm writing about, that the options for placing furniture and utensils on it, you need to look "before"

And what, someone here tried to do it differently?




And with reference specifically to Anya's kitchen. Now their line-up is about the same as in the first picture. There was a set in a line, but a shallow module was attached to it and actually made a corner kitchen with modules of different depths. There are deep modules along the long wall, and shallow ones along the short one. That is, they had about 1.6-1.4 meters of working surfaces, but ... For some reason, they lacked this length so much that they had to use an extension for the equipment ..

So the taste and color of the markers are different. Someone even one surface 60 cm wide is enough, but someone may need more and fatter.

View from above:

The gas riser is as inconveniently located ...
It turns out that if you do not do anything with the riser, then between the stove and the window you need to plan some kind of furniture with a total width of about 1 meter.
In the variant where there are tables between the stove and the window, in this case it will be necessary to reduce the distance between the sink and the stove and increase the distance between the window and the stove. So that the gas riser is behind the furniture, and not behind the oven and cooking.
The column option may work. There is just a table 40 + a column of 60, the riser falls for a small table.
But in both versions, you will have to do something with the battery, because it can interfere with opening the oven door, pulling out the drawers completely, etc.
Or take the general principle as a basis, but change the modules. For example, make a column with an oven not so low, but high, with the oven at the countertop level. And below, under the oven, there are 2 hinged facades of 30 cm each. Then neither the battery nor the gas riser will need to be altered.

I understand that there needs to be at least 15 cm to ensure that the frying pan with a handle fits.

More is better. From 30 cm, so that the furniture does not heat up and does not stagnate, so that any dishes can be freely placed during cooking, so that it is convenient to stand at the stove. You can find this figure in the recommendations of furniture makers and kitchen designers. You can deduce the same figure from your own experience of using the kitchen. Consider how far spatter and fumes from the stove usually travel from your cooking style or the way your family members cook. For example, if you have ever had small household appliances next to the stove, remember how far away from the stove were the appliances, the body of which you had to wash from splashes from the stove.
The kitchen I use has small work surfaces. 40, 55 and 30 cm ..
55 - between the sink and the stove, the most popular. It's not enough for me. At one time, an electric geyser coffee maker and an electric kettle stood on this surface. The distance turned out to be about 15-20 cm from these devices to cooking, cooking does not smoke, electric. But ... Since my husband really loves to fry something without a lid, and I, too, sometimes cook without a lid, the kettle and coffee pot were regularly contaminated with splashes from the stove. Over time, I hesitated, I got tired of washing their hulls. I removed the coffee pot to another place, on the windowsill. I moved the kettle as far away from the stove as possible. Now he stands at a distance of about 30 cm from the stove and the spray from the stove does not reach him.

When there is no place to make the distance between the cooking and the nearest vertical surface, some make cooking close to refrigerators, walls, columns with appliances.
Courageous people without complexes, capable of recognizing their skin and talking about them, then shoot videos for YouTube from a series of "what mistakes did I make in my kitchen."

Vidos. again the aunts from Khrushchev. We made repairs, first they shot the video "What a cool new kitchen we have", after a while the video "Oh, we realized that we screwed up." Among other things, they tell what troubles they had because of the cooking, which is located close to the refrigerator.
From 8-44, a story about these troubles:





Anchic, catch while the corrected version without the column, taking into account the dimensions that you posted today.

The gas riser is just a pain ...
There, you may have to order a table with a non-standard depth. Depends on the manufacturer, some manufacturers have shallow-depth housings, specifically to fit different pipes behind them. For example, at the factory, the link to the drawing of which I dwelled, the depth of the tables along the body is 510 mm, at the request of the customer, they promise to make cases with a depth of 560, which they consider non-standard. With a facade, respectively, a 510 case is approximately 530 mm. The removal of the table top is still approximately 20 mm. Total, 550. And the countertop is 600.5 cm deep, there is a gap between the furniture and the wall, closed by the countertop.
This is not a recommendation from the factory, I cannot recommend them because I have never ordered anything from them. It's just infa that some manufacturers may have a shallow case.

According to your dimensions, the rm of the corner where the sink is, about 210 cm is obtained to the gas riser.
In the picture sink 800 + table 600 + "plate" 600 = 2000 mm.
Well, that is, in theory, even with a thick layer of plaster on the wall of the closet, such modules will fit between the wall of the closet and the gas riser.
If, after the plaster, something will not fit, or, on the contrary, there will be a lot of space, then you can try to stick in a sink with a 45th facade and / or a table with narrower drawers, not 60, but 50.
In general, sink + table + cooking are plus or minus 195 - 205 cm.
The window shows a module with a facade of 40. You can play with it in different ways. For example, bevelling, if after a draft it will not fit or the facade will touch the battery (however, not all furniture makers will undertake to make a beveled case).
You can saw down the body in width, instead of 40 facade, put a facade 30 and a false panel, which will fit. Attach the cabinet door to the bezel with 175-degree hinges.

This is if without alterations to the gas riser and the battery.
Perhaps the option with a column in the corner by the window will turn out better in terms of connecting the stove to gas. Well, that is, we swap table 40 and table 50 by the window, the gas riser is then obtained not in a table with drawers, which is more expensive in non-standard, but in a table with a door and shelves, which is cheaper, and which you and your husband can cut down. If 40 does not fit, then you will have to replace this table with 30.
But in these options, you may have to deal with the issue with the battery.



A couple of options in which, perhaps, no alterations are required at all.
Neither the battery, nor the gas riser, and even the window sill, may need to be touched.

Option A
The kitchen is not up to the end of the wall with an oven under cooking Along the long wall, modules with a total length of 280 cm.25 cm - stock for decoration and curtains. If 25 cm seems a lot, then you can try to increase the length of the kitchen by 5 cm by washing, or by replacing the bottle holder with a table 30 cm wide, which, in fact, can also be with pull-out baskets.


Option B
The kitchen is not up to the end of the wall with a column for the oven and microwave in the corner by the window. On the long side, modules with a total length of 290.15 cm is a margin for finishing and a gap for opening the drawer for the oven and ovens, so that they do not crash into the battery.
Unfortunately, the thickness of the battery is not in these dimensions. So this variation is drawn at random.

It is also possible that in this version it will be possible to swap the refrigerator and the column with the appliances.

It will be necessary to aim at the place, whether the refrigerator will open normally if it stands at a distance of 15 cm from the wall with a window. Or the battery will get in the way and you will need to carry the battery to install the refrigerator in that corner.

Option B.
"All eggs in one basket." Probably, in addition to the microwave, it was placed on the brackets in place of the refrigerator, next to the dining table. And with a table in reserve under the PMM 45 cm.

Along the long wall about 291 cm, 14 reserves for finishing and opening the refrigerator. It is necessary to look at the place, whether the refrigerator will open with such a gap. If not, then cut the module between the refrigerator and the stove by 5 cm. Do not 50, but 45.
Along a short wall, about 147-149 cm (an additional sidewall is needed for the table, it will be needed when the table changes to PMM).



Anchic, now I will ask you a "seditious" question.
But if the kitchen is from wall to wall, that is, like this: https://mcooker-enm.tomathouse.com/ga...pics/88394/vagonchik8.jpg , at the end without a column and without a refrigerator, with two quite decent work surfaces, do you definitely need a shallow extension to the sink?

Maybe go back to your parent's in-line kitchen option?
It's just that with the annex with takeoff and landing places at the table, everything is pretty sad. Three sat down - no one else can enter or exit without disturbing the one who sits at the door. If I understood everything correctly, now the layout of the kitchen and the situation with the seats you have is as follows:


If the extension is removed and the kitchen is made simply in line, with the crockery in the same place where you have it, then you can either put the table wider, or leave the same one, three people can sit quietly behind it, and at the same time the entrance and exit will be free ...
The extension, of course, turns out to be roomy if you do not mow it too much. But the working surface, on which you can "forever" put some kind of equipment, doesn’t come out too much. After all, only something very small can be put on the side of the sink. Elbows will touch a large one. There is only the edge of the annex at the entrance.

And in the variant "all eggs in one basket", too, with take-off and landing places it turns out better than now, because the space under the table and the seats around it increases by no less than 40 cm. Mom is not a pathetic stool on which she is forced to lean on the refrigerator, and a whole "throne" with a back can be placed.

[Anchic]

Anchic, this is what happens in different variants with seats.
These are options similar to your current kitchen layout. The refrigerator is in the same place, the extension is the same depth, the sink is the same size, with the same incised bowl.
With modules not to the end of the wall:

With a countertop (and maybe modules) to the end of the wall:

And "unfamiliar" options.
Refrigerator, oven on the sides of the window:

"All in one basket-1" with a sink along the pantry and 45 replacement table under the PMM. One corner by the window is freed up, you can fantasize about another table:

[/ spoiler
"All in one basket-2" with the same sink as you have now. One corner by the window is also freed up.

[renard]

renard, Thank you! I was thinking about the last option, a similar one. Only the narrowness did not allow the table to unfold. And if you leave it as it is now (with the long side along the wall), then it will not come in very much when you move the sink. Although I really want to move it there.

And also you infa about the drawers by the window.I already wrote that for some manufacturers of kitchen furniture, cases without a facade and countertops have a depth of about 510 mm. After installing the kitchen, a gap of 4-5 cm is obtained between the cases and the wall, in which you can lay pipes and pull open thick cables.
I now have a kitchen with just such buildings. It has a module with drawers. A drawer with a facade about 48 cm deep. Today I measured how far the drawers move forward. Measured about 37 cm.
But in order to remove a box from such a module altogether, or install a box in it, you need about 50 cm.
That is, if the same module with drawers in your kitchen were installed in the corner by the window, then the drawers in it would not crash into the battery when opened. But it would be completely impossible to remove the box from the case, it would rest against the battery.

renard, thanks! I was thinking about the last option, a similar one. Only the narrowness did not allow the table to unfold. And if you leave it as it is now (with the long side along the wall), then it will not come in very much when you move the sink. Although I really want to move it there.

In that version, if you do not try to install the PMM, then you can attach something else to the sink, beveled or radius.




I have a radius at the entrance. 30 with a 40 curved facade. I like that there is a smooth rounding at the entrance to the kitchen. You can't store a lot in a 30-ku, but a small multicooker, spare bowls for a multicooker, glass bowls for microwave ovens and other small things can fit into it.
Compared to a rectangular 30-ka, the end radius is more convenient, because access to the cabinet is better, one sidewall of such a cabinet is smaller.

But different people have different approaches to bevels and radii in such places, just like to columns with an oven. Some believe that the bevel or radius in situations like yours is necessary, otherwise children will regularly enter the corner with their foreheads, and adult bumps on their hips will fill. Others believe that bevels and radii are evil because they gobble up useful space.
Men especially for some reason do not understand why a bevel or a radius.
Well, also the bevel and radius do not fit into all styles and are not very trendy now. In "Provence" or "classics" will fit exactly. But in some "Scandinavian" style a la IKEA, which is characterized by simple rectangular shapes, a bevel or radius will not look very appropriate.

And also radius facades are more expensive than straight ones and are not found in all manufacturers.

and what will the respected congregation say about the ergonomics of the wardrobe in the hallway?

initial data: there is a niche 110cm wide and 200cm high. the right half, that is, the right 55cm along the inner wall of the niche is occupied by email. wardrobe.

Some believe that the bevel or radius in situations like yours is necessary, otherwise children will regularly enter the corner with their foreheads, and adult bumps on their hips will fill.

My husband and I are like that. In general, we do not like it when the corners stick out. I will definitely walk with them covered in bruises. And my son is growing up the same. It even crashes into the walls. Here, at the shelf, my husband made a bevel so that the corner would not interfere. And the mikra hangs on a homemade shelf, there are also beveled corners. Therefore, either we will beve the corner, or it will be rounded. Here we will look at the situation.

and what will the respected congregation say about the ergonomics of the wardrobe in the hallway?

Is it a compartment or a closet in the closet?
If it is a compartment, then it is immediately striking that to open the drawer in the center of the cabinet you will have to put 3 doors. And at a width of 110, three doors are not made, ask Yandex about the minimum, maximum and optimal door sizes for sliding wardrobes. At a width of 110, 2 doors in a wardrobe will work well.

Here we will look at the situation.

Well, discuss with your family, choose, maybe you will choose a set of tables and drawers. Without the transfer of the gas riser and the battery, the ideal option did not work, but everything is more or less normal, for different tastes and habits.
I don’t know what your habits are. Or maybe you work in the kitchen, like Vicki, with your husband or mom in four hands. For some reason, your extension to the sink materialized ...This means that there were not enough work surfaces for some reason.
Your current layout is very good, the kitchen seems to be angular, but the "dead corner" is small. There are many work surfaces. Choose what kind of cooking you want. The refrigerator can be any, because it stands separately from the furniture and you don't have to bother how he gets married with furniture.

People are very different, each his own. Whoever needs to give a refrigerator next to the work area, someone definitely needs to stash the refrigerator somewhere, with a freestanding refrigerator, the kitchen seems scary to them, and a freestanding refrigerator at the entrance is generally a disaster. Someone has an oven in a column, and nothing else. Who needs more work surfaces, and the oven will do well under cooking. With brews too ... Someone thinks that dominoes are enough for his eyes and ears. Give someone at least 4 burners. And so that the handles are not in front, but on the side.
Someone loves bottle-makers. Someone thinks bottle holders are shit.
To whom the bevel, and to whom - we do not need this old-fashioned "collective farm", which eats up the storage space.

[renard]

Is it a compartment or a closet in the closet?

renard, the picture is just for information
I have a niche 200cm height, 110cm width, 65cm depth.

I have a niche 200cm height, 110cm width, 65cm depth.

With such a depth, it is better to make 4 hinged facades (2 at the top, 2 at the bottom), if they have room to open, the compartment door eats a lot from the depth.

the compartment door eats a lot from the depth.

the door will be like a closet. it is to order.
I was offered just such a filling. but I do not like it.

how to improve ergonomics?

[Sens]

Sens, try to mentally sort things out on these shelves and so on. Then it will be clearer for you.

For some reason, your extension to the sink materialized ... This means that there were not enough work surfaces for some reason.

Well yes. I bought a planetary mixer, but there is nowhere to put it. And to put it somewhere far away - I will not use it, because it weighs 10 kg and I don't want to get it out every time. But even earlier, a shelf for the micra appeared above this curbstone, this is generally a long time ago when the micra was bought. There was nowhere to put, too, so that there was a place for cooking. Mom and I take turns cooking, but, of course, while one is cooking, someone can knock around a little, like pouring and drinking tea. And yes, we cook on 4 burners. And less bottom, because I have no other equipment for heat treatment and is not planned. By the way, I also thought about moving the gas riser. It will be necessary to find out the price of the question, maybe we will pull it and make it more convenient for ourselves.

[Sens]

Sens, and in which of the departments will there be an electrical panel, which takes 55 cm from you? Is that more, with a hanger or what?
Actually, the flap in the closet is not good. But people do that ...

Well yes. I bought a planetary mixer, but there is nowhere to put it. And to put it somewhere far away - I will not use it, because it weighs 10 kg and I don't want to get it out every time.

Then your layout is the most correct one.

By the way, I also thought about moving the gas riser.

Well, there actually, even without the transfer more or less, everything works out. Sink 80, table 60, cooking 60 fit in, and there is still a small margin left so that the cooking is not close to the riser.
Probably the problem with the outlet on the riser. It turns out right above the stove, right?

It would be nice, of course, that there are large identical surfaces of 80 cm between the cooking and the window and the cooking and the sink.Or there is a meter between the cooking and the sink, and 60 cm between the cooking and the window ...
But with such a breakdown, the riser is right behind the cooking.

You can put the stove closer to the window, then in the usual arrangement between the sink and the stove, a very large surface is obtained. True, between the cooking and the wall - absolutely minuscule.
20-25 centimeters. And if you put the cooking close to that corner, you will also have to glue the tiles at the corner. Paravozom will raise the question of the design of the end of the tile sticking out at the slope.
And the same locomotive will have problems with the curtain. 80-100 cm from the stove to the window and to the corner is an excellent distance, nothing can fly there from the stove.

[renard]

then in your usual line-up

renard, I beg you, replace a with oh, I'm sure you know how to spell the word "layout" correctly. Well, at least don't read this topic, it hurts so much in every post. ((At first I took it as a deliberate banter, but the joke dragged on ...

I found an interesting photo - a microwave in the shelf, behind a microwave gas riser ... I wonder what size the microwave is, that a riser is placed behind it. The riser itself is "practically" decorated with a tourniquet.

For the "all-in-one" option, I first thought to stick the microwave under the shelf between the stove and the refrigerator, forgetting about the gas riser. Even in the message I mentioned such an option. Then I remembered about the riser, I thought that it would interfere with the microwave, and erased it.
And someone still managed to do this.

And more about the option of a non-built microwave in the shelf - the shelf should be planned not end-to-end with the microwave body.
My microwave sharp, for example, is 46 cm wide. It fits in a shelf 50 cm wide. But according to the instructions for the microwave, this cannot be done, because the ventilation holes in the microwave housing will be closed. That is, under my sharp you need a shelf with a width of at least 60 cm.



Wow.

Interestingly, there are any holes in the box for the riser or they are tightly walled up.

renard, I beg you, replace a with oh, I'm sure ...

At your request, I replaced where editing was still available.
I am also sure that in reality you are a very intelligent and tactful lady, and not a person with a Grammar-Nazi complex, just for some reason your private messages do not work today.



Another interesting photo. On it is the solution to the issue with the protruding corner of the countertop near the column with the oven. The column body is deeper than the standard one, protruding relative to the rest of the furniture. Only in the case of Anya, the column cannot be especially "flush", the pier by the window for the installation of the kitchen is therefore a few centimeters less than necessary.

And on a width of 110, three sashes are not made

Yandex knows a lot
Another thing is that such narrow ones are simply not needed.

[Sens]

Sens, sorry, I wanted to sleep at night, the attention was not the same, I answered you incorrectly.
At a height of 2 meters, swinging facades should not be split into 2 at the top and 2 at the bottom.
This is a low cabinet, you just need two doors.
For some reason I thought that you will have it in the ceiling.
I read that the height is 2 meters, but I presented a wardrobe to the ceiling ..

Anya, why do you need to change the refrigerator and the column with the oven in places? To burn yourself once again on the side surfaces? And when the oven is running, Mom won't lean against the refrigerator. And where will the hot air go from the oven? Extractor hood at one end of the kitchen, oven at the other. Okay, bread, and the fumes from, say, baked meat will all settle on the wallpaper behind the column ...

I was offered just such a filling. but I do not like it.

Che-that, I don't understand the idea of ​​your furniture makers at all. They did not explain why there was a rack in the middle in such a narrow compartment with a hanger? Why not just a barbell?

Che-that, I don't understand the idea of ​​your furniture makers at all. They did not explain why there was a rack in the middle in such a narrow compartment with a hanger? Why not just a barbell?

so that one of the compartments has two rods. on right.
but that's not an option. there will be one bar